236: Preserving Your Self-Worth – Confronting Manipulative Behaviors & Setting Boundaries In Dating
Transcript – Scroll To Bottom
Intro :
On this episode of Inner Confidence Podcast, host Robbie Kramer is joined by guest Amir to discuss the psychology of having other options in a romantic situation and maintaining a sense of self-worth. Kramer and Amir also share personal stories about confrontations with women who violated boundaries and the importance of prioritizing one’s well-being over the desire for sex. Additionally, Kramer discusses his past struggles with self-respect and the profound shift in his dating life that occurred after he learned to maintain boundaries and put himself first. Don’t miss out on the valuable advice and personal insights shared in this episode.
Show Notes:
03:24 – “We were staying together, and she pulled a Houdini on me!” – Host shares his heartbreaking story!
07:23 – “Can you help me move my stuff” – She wanted to move her exes stuff to my house!
10:02 – “You were really helping her out a lot!?” – See how much the host overinvested himself into this girl and why!
14:43 – “We are going on this trip, if you’re down for some crazy fun like threesomes…” – How the host ended up inviting this girl on a trip to the Maldives!
16:03 – “She made sure I saw her go on the boat with the bartender” – Find out how the host handed this manipulative tactic!
17:48 – “They talk about how open-minded they are until you put them in a situation” – We dissect!
21:28 – “The most powerful drugs in the world” – Host discusses being in love and what it does to you!
25:08 – No text, no call, no communication! – Host shares how he coped with the betrayed feelings of being ghosted!
27:40 – “Your normal friends won’t understand!” – Learn how a community like “Inner Confidence” helps you walk through tough woman situations in life!
28:48 – “I would lose my self-respect to get sex” – Host shares his unhealthy way of getting validation from woman in the past!
30:47 – “How do women respond to you NOW that they realized you can not be manipulated?” – Host explains what changed with his new-found self-respect!
33:57 – “My brain was hijacked with those thoughts!” – How the host processed being ghosted!
34:40 – Finally hearing from her again! – Find out his reaction when the girl hits him up again after ghosting the host!
38:22 – Enforcing boundaries! – Guest breaks down boundaries and why you need them!
40:17 – “She sent me a bunch of nudes and apologized…” – Find out how the host reacted!
41:28 – You have not met a guy who values himself! – The importance of self-respect!
44:50 – Chasing energy VS Guys enjoying themselves! – We compare and contrast!
47:44 – You need to have options! – If you don’t have options, you’re screwed!
50:42 – “What would you wish you would have done differently?” – Host reflects on mistakes and what he would do differently!
55:00 – General advice for men taking girls on trips! – Learn what to take into consideration when taking chicks on trips!
59:07 – Conclusion – SELF-RESPECT!
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Transcript :
Robbie Kramer [00:00:00]:
We’re going on this trip, it’s gonna be other girls. We’re down for, like, crazy, fun, freesomes, that sort of thing. Like, let’s do it. She’s like, yeah.
Amir [00:00:05]:
They’ll talk about how open minded they are and how freaky they are, and then you put them in a situation, and they’re, like, way less cool with it.
Robbie Kramer [00:00:10]:
I was like, Yo, if you want to go fuck the bartender, like, go ahead. It was like, Where the fuck are you?
Amir [00:00:14]:
Like that crazy bitch. And she’s like, well, that’s like, no, no, that’s not right either. Nothing is happening. Nothing.
Robbie Kramer [00:00:20]:
I am not gonna see this girl ever again. And that really fucking hurt.
Amir [00:00:23]:
You have to maintain your boundary and dignity in the face of betrayal, even when it is so painful to do so. And it would be so much easier to say, yeah, climb in the bed, baby. We’re past this.
Robbie Kramer [00:00:33]:
Welcome to the Inner Confidence Podcast, where we bring you men’s dating and lifestyle advice that doesn’t suck. I’m your host, Robbie Kramer, a former collegiate golfer turned poker pro turned finance guy who became obsessed with learning about male female attraction and dynamics, and passionate about teaching men how to improve and optimize their love life. Tune in each week and we’ll bring you the latest and greatest strategies on how to get more dates, how to build a thriving social circle that brings the best men and women into your life, how to become a better networker, and how to design a lifestyle that makes all your buddies jealous. If you’re new to the show, I recommend you download my First Date Protocol. It’s the best piece of content I have. It’ll help you optimize your first date and subsequent dates. And I like to connect with my listeners personally, so if you want to grab a copy of that, please send me a direct message on Instagram. I’m at Robbie Kramer. Now, let’s dive into this week’s content. What up, guys? We’re back. If you listen to our recent podcast, where we talked about double booking and the emotions of being flaked on, hopefully you did anyways. But that led to a bunch of questions from the guys in the IC community about dealing with difficult emotions in the dating world. And Amir was asking me a bunch of questions about girls that have done things that made me feel hurt and disrespected. And I acted in many ways that I consult with my clients not to. I was overreactive. I was simpy, I was salty. So I’m excited today because Amir is going to interview me, and I’m going to tell a bunch of stories about when I fucked up, which is cool because I don’t have to do the heavy lifting. So thanks, brother. Appreciate you interviewing me on this today.
Amir [00:02:20]:
Yeah, well, you’re always looking at other people to do your job. I know how it is, Robbie. No, it’s funny, because the thing that brought us out is I’ve been seeing a girl for several months, right? Social circle girl. And she set up concrete plans with me, including picking me up from the airport and then just completely blew me off. And this is somebody I had a lot of trust with. And it just super hurt, right? Like super duper hurt. I had a really bad one day, and in talking to Robbie about it, I realized, like, I’m not alone. Like, I’m not the only one that’s experienced this. And it was really helpful to hear some of Robbie’s stories of this sort of stuff.
Robbie Kramer [00:02:56]:
I got a lot.
Amir [00:02:59]:
So I guess to start with, Robbie, I’d love to hear a story about a time when a girl you were interested invested in. I would say not just like a first date kind of situation, but somebody you had invested in and felt connection with, made you feel really disrespected or even betrayed in a way that you just didn’t expect and didn’t see coming. And then I want to hear your emotions, all that sort of stuff along the way. Does anything come to mind?
Robbie Kramer [00:03:24]:
For sure. To protect the innocent, we’ll call her Carrie.
Amir [00:03:30]:
Is she really innocent?
Robbie Kramer [00:03:33]:
No. I should probably but far from innocent. And this was, I think, in 2019, and I was single and mingling. We ended up getting really close really quickly. I think some of my love you were exchanged. And then she basically pulled like a houdini houdiniing act for two days, just like this flake. No call, no text. We were actually staying together when this happened. She just left and didn’t come back. She was like, oh, I’m just going to run out to pick something up, and then just didn’t come back. And I was like, what the hell is going on? And the way I kind of dealt with that, I think is interesting. The red flags leading up to that, I think are pretty interesting. So that could be a good story.
Amir [00:04:29]:
Yeah, for sure. Well, let’s see, just real quick, not a ton of detail here, but how did you meet and how sort of much did you invest that led you to sort of have some trust with her?
Robbie Kramer [00:04:41]:
So we met through my friend group. She was a friend of a friend. We were having a party. She came to that party, we hit it off. And what was interesting about that first meeting is there was some tension and drama between my girlfriend, who brought her and Carrie. They were apparently friends for maybe like six months to a year, but they were like, best friends, like super close. But I hadn’t really heard about this girl prior from the other girl, so I was already like, it’s weird, I’ve never heard you talk about this girl. And I had a lot of experience at that time, just hanging out with models and girls. And I always remembered when girls would say, oh, she’s my best friend, that was usually like, yeah, that’s probably BS because it’s like, everyone was everybody’s best friend, so right. When they said that, I don’t know, maybe it’s just the way that they said it or something, but that kind of clued me into a little bit of a red flag. And then, sure enough, later that night when we’re all partying together, they get in an argument and a little bit of a fight, and then they both come to me and they’re talking shit to each other. So I just kind of found the whole thing fascinating, but that was my first kind of clue in that like, okay, maybe there’s some drama here. So then we end up hanging out. We start hooking up just real quick.
Amir [00:06:16]:
Before we move on. I’ve noticed that sort of same thing. Actually, this was confusing with my girlfriends. Like, friends that are women that I have, and we’re close, right? Like, really close. And they would suddenly have this new friend that I’ve never heard of that is the best in the world, right? And then that friend would start being weird, and they’re like, oh, yeah, well, I barely kind of really just met her, and it was like, I’ve noticed this a lot too, so it’s interesting to see that you’ve seen the same thing, right?
Robbie Kramer [00:06:47]:
And then the story started to change later, right? So it went from, like, best friend we’re super close, to like, yeah, actually, I’m not that close with her when things aren’t going the way that they wanted. So what ends up happening is after that fight, the original girl who I know leaves, and then I start hooking up with Carrie and things are good. We’re on this little trip together, so we’re spending a lot of time. We drive back from that trip, and then when we get to La. She was like, hey, I just kind of like she had this really weird living situation because she was kind of living with that other girl, right? But she had all of her stuff at this dude’s house in the Valley, and she was like, hey, can you help me move my stuff? I was going to move it into the other girl’s house. We’ll call her Laura. I was going to move it into Laura’s house. But now after that fight, I don’t think we’re going to be friends anymore, so I just need to put it into storage. I’m like, all right, so this is.
Amir [00:07:59]:
After you’ve hung out with them together and they fought. Before you go on this trip, she wants help moving her stuff from her ex’s house into your house or into storage. Into storage, right. That’s the thing, because you’re investing quite a lot. You’ve invested quite a lot of energy at this. Like, you’re investing a lot in this girl, so you must feel a building amount of connection and trust. Yes.
Robbie Kramer [00:08:18]:
Oh, yeah. Well, we had hung out basically for, like, four days straight. Because the party we met at was actually in Sedona, Arizona. And then we drove back together to La. From Sedona. So we had some really amazing sex in the RV that we drove back from Sedona, spent the night traveling together, picking up a trailer, like, doing all this stuff. So, yeah, I was starting to really feel the connection.
Amir [00:08:44]:
Where does RV sex rank relative to those penthouse sexes? At the top bed of a pickup truck.
Robbie Kramer [00:08:54]:
This was a pretty gangster RV. It was like a 30 foot bounder, and we were actually stuck in traffic on the Ten freeway, and it was, like, not moving. So we just had sex in the front of the cab of the RV. But we were above all the cars. So, like, I think a few truckers drove by and saw us, but that was it.
Amir [00:09:17]:
Pretty kind of hot bed of a pickup truck, by the way. Very uncomfortable. Very. Keep going.
Robbie Kramer [00:09:27]:
Yeah. Okay. So we’re back in La. And she was like, all right, let me put my stuff in storage. But she was a singer, and she like most hot girls living in La. Trying to make it as an entertainer, you know, an actress, model, singer, whatever. She didn’t have much money, right? So I was like, listen, I’ve got a buddy who’s got this big property in Torrance. He’s one of my best friends. He’s always letting me store shit there. He’s got this huge garage. If you want, why don’t you just put your shit in there temporarily?
Amir [00:10:07]:
You’re really helping her out, like, a lot.
Robbie Kramer [00:10:09]:
Yeah, I mean, I was like, this is going to be my new girlfriend. I was into this girl. Yeah, really into her. So we go to this house in the Valley. There’s, like, these dudes there, and I got the vibe that it was an ex boyfriend, that the place was her exes, but she didn’t want to tell me that. So that was another red flag.
Amir [00:10:32]:
Oh, you didn’t know it was an ex? I thought she told me that.
Robbie Kramer [00:10:35]:
She just said it was, like a dude friend, like a platonic dude friend. This doesn’t quite add up. And then it was like, four dudes living there. The dude wasn’t there. That her friend. But the way that she was interacting with the other guys made me think, like, this was definitely her ex, which I wouldn’t have given a shit. Right. It’s normal for her to live with the ex, but it’s like, why lie about it? Does that all make sense so far?
Amir [00:11:07]:
Yeah, I mean, it sounds like sounds like you you met this girl, fell for her heart because of that connection. You felt, like, comfortable investing, and you were kind of seeing some red flags but ignoring them.
Robbie Kramer [00:11:20]:
Yeah, that’s pretty much exactly right. I was living a very sort of open minded lifestyle back then, and this girl also seemed like she was down for that. The girl that we met through was a girl that I had hooked up with before, and she didn’t mind. So the thing that was on my mind was I had a trip planned to the Maldives, a party that I was actually throwing for basically, I was supposed to leave, like, three days after we did the move. And because things were going so well with this girl, I was like, I want to bring her on that trip. So then we went to the passport office because her passport was expired. We got an expedited passport for her. We’re going through that process. We missed the flight because the passport didn’t get in time. So that cost me, like, probably $1,500. But we sorted it all out. We get her stuff, obviously, to my buddy’s place, and we fly to the Maldives. In the Maldives.
Amir [00:12:26]:
So one thing that I’m hearing that I think is interesting, it sounds like you were investing a lot in her and solving her problems. Do you feel like she was investing anything back, or was this just, like, a great ride for her?
Robbie Kramer [00:12:36]:
I guess she was investing back in terms of just her way of being, her behavior. She was very sweet. She was very feminine emotionally.
Amir [00:12:45]:
She was emotionally in connection. Okay. Got it. So you didn’t feel like it was asymmetric?
Robbie Kramer [00:12:51]:
No. And actually, she even met my mom for a second, because on the drive back from sedona through La. I had to stop in newport beach at my folks house and pick up some stuff or drop off some stuff, and she met my mom for, like, a hot second. I felt like that was, like, a too soon sort of meeting, and my mom obviously didn’t know what was happening. But my mom can be she’s, like a big personality. She’s the Jewish mom. Very talkative. So, yeah, another piece of data, if that matters.
Amir [00:13:22]:
Do you feel, in retrospect, you were over invested in this girl?
Robbie Kramer [00:13:25]:
No, because I was very clearly not going to be committing to her. And I knew the second she showed up on this Maldives trip where there was an insane amount of competition that I wouldn’t really have to worry about that, if that makes sense.
Amir [00:13:44]:
Totally.
Robbie Kramer [00:13:45]:
Yeah.
Amir [00:13:48]:
And you solved all her problems. You got her passport. Now she’s coming to the Maldives.
Robbie Kramer [00:13:51]:
She’s coming to the Maldives. Yeah. I guess, looking back, if you just look at it in terms of an investment yeah, I was definitely more invested than her at that point, because, like you said, I was solving her problems. I was doing a lot of work. Well, she’s just kind of, like, chilling and kicking back.
Amir [00:14:07]:
She made you feel good about it, but you were still doing the work.
Robbie Kramer [00:14:09]:
Yeah, I mean, she did pull her weight a little bit. She found some k to bring to the Maldives.
Amir [00:14:15]:
Always appreciated.
Robbie Kramer [00:14:17]:
Always appreciated. She had, like, a veterinarian friend.
Amir [00:14:21]:
Love veterinarian friends.
Robbie Kramer [00:14:25]:
But that was about it. So should we talk about the Maldives next?
Amir [00:14:31]:
Yeah, I mean, so the specifics of the Maldives trip maybe don’t matter so much, except for any red flags you saw and any sort of further investment you made that made you feel closer. Right?
Robbie Kramer [00:14:44]:
Yeah, there was one instance that was important. So we’re on this trip. It’s a crazy party environment. The ratio is heavily stacked in me and my buddies who were on the trip’s favor, right? So I knew that would kind of be taxing for her. We hooked up with some other girls. We had some fun like that. And I tried to keep the connection really established with her. I think at one point, though, she got and I was brutally dead honest about everything. Like, we’re going on this trip. There’s going to be other girls. If you’re down for some crazy fun threesomes, that sort of thing, let’s do it. And she’s like, yeah, I’m totally down for that. I love that. I love chicks. And I guess at one point she got really jealous. But she didn’t she didn’t, like, mention anything. She didn’t she tried to hide it, but we had set up this very open sort of communication, this open dialogue. Like, anytime you feel jealous, anytime you feel anything, I want you to tell me. And she was doing that, and I felt like that was possible, but I don’t remember exactly what happened. It seemed to me like there was really not a reason for it. There wasn’t, like, a specific instance that I could put my finger on and be like, I did something that made her incredibly jealous, or I did something wrong. But she got clearly salty towards me. And then she made sure I saw her get on the little dinghy boat with the bartender to go run an errand to pick up fish from, like.
Amir [00:16:26]:
Good sex on a dinghy. It’s just a dinghy. Dinghy sex has got to be below RV sex.
Robbie Kramer [00:16:34]:
It was big enough to be like a ski boat, but not big. It could fit, like, six people. Right? So not quite a dinghy, but not like your boat, for example. There’s not even like, a comfortable seat. Just basically like you get what I’m saying? Almost like a fishing boat. Right? But she made it very obvious that she was, like, going off with this bartender who was like, this maldivian dude who was definitely, like, the most attractive worker on the boat. But it’s not like I was threatened by this guy or anything. I was just like, this is clearly a manipulative tactic to try to make me jealous, right? And it was just weird.
Amir [00:17:15]:
Did it work, though? Were you jealous?
Robbie Kramer [00:17:16]:
I was upset that she was, like, lying. I knew she was lying. I was like, yo, if you want to go fuck the bartender, go ahead, if that’s what you want to do. I was very open minded.
Amir [00:17:27]:
You want bartender dick in a dinghy.
Robbie Kramer [00:17:29]:
Yeah. It was kind of embarrassing for her that she would want to do that. So I was like, it’s not going to really I saw it clearly as a ploy for her to try to as a manipulative tactic, and then she was also lying about it. So that was the next huge red flag.
Amir [00:17:49]:
Yeah. I mean, I’ve actually seen this before, though, where when you first meet a girl, they’re trying to guess what they think you want to hear. So they’ll talk about how open minded they are and how freaky they are, and then you put them in a situation, and they’re, like, way less cool with it than they had advertised. And it’s because they were trying to be what they thought you wanted to hear them be. You think that might be some of that?
Robbie Kramer [00:18:10]:
Some of it, yeah. But this probably happened on day three out of the seven day trip. And prior to that, everything was great. We were falling more in love, having these fun experiences on this amazing sort of vacation and paradise, literally. We were on private desert islands.
Amir [00:18:32]:
So this trip is actually really good, except for this. Like, you guys are getting closer and closer and closer, and you’re feeling more secure in your attachment with her.
Robbie Kramer [00:18:39]:
Yeah.
Amir [00:18:39]:
Okay.
Robbie Kramer [00:18:39]:
I felt like, this is awesome. I found the perfect girlfriend who’s down for us to play around and have fun, and she’s on the same page. She’s not super jealous. I wasn’t super jealous. Right. So it seemed like a really good fit for what I was looking for, what she was looking for. It really just seemed like I had found someone who was mature enough to deal with some of these tough emotions and live this sort of very sexual lifestyle that I was interested in.
Amir [00:19:02]:
So there’s a few red flags along the way, total. But overall, you’re sort of a few weeks into spending a lot of time with this girl, and you’re sort of falling for her more and more, and it seems she is too.
Robbie Kramer [00:19:13]:
Correct, and it felt very sort of even on the emotional investment level.
Amir [00:19:17]:
So then now let’s go to the point where she betrayed you. Tell me exactly sort of what happened. I assume it’s after the trip. Yes.
Robbie Kramer [00:19:28]:
Well, so what happened after that incident where she went on the dinghy with the bartender is, like we talked about it. I knew she was still kind of lying, but we got past it. And then the next four days of the trip was, like, total couple vibes. Like, we didn’t hook up with any other girls. It was just like, me and her having this romantic getaway. And then the flight that the the trip back from the Maldives, it took it took, like, 36 hours almost to get back because we had to connect through Dubai and then no, sorry, connect through Hong Kong. So we spent a night in. We had sex in one of those airport sleeping quarters where you can rent the rooms by the hour.
Amir [00:20:11]:
We got to rank all these places.
Robbie Kramer [00:20:17]:
It was so weird. We connected from Dubai and then Hong Kong and then flew across the Pacific back to La. But this sleeping quarter thing was actually it was, like, some of the hottest sex ever. I don’t know what it was about. It it was like, you kind of like, get the room and they know what you’re doing, but they’re like, oh, it’s just for changing. And there’s, like, a shower in there and a bed, and it was perfect. It was crazy. Yeah. And then we’re on the flight, spending time together, cuddling up. I think at that point, she told me she loved me and she was so happy to start our life together in La. So far, so good. Right?
Amir [00:20:57]:
So you guys are, like you’re going all in here, like, pretty far.
Robbie Kramer [00:21:01]:
Yeah, I bought all in, and I definitely had a tendency to do that to an unhealthy degree.
Amir [00:21:16]:
That was, like, five, four years ago. Right. You’ve obviously grown since then. But that shows even, like, being at a pretty advanced level, that sort of tendency to just, like, fall for somebody and, like, go in too fast, it still gets you.
Robbie Kramer [00:21:30]:
Oh, man. I mean, it’s like those those emotions are, like, the most powerful drugs in the world. When you’re spending time and you’re having fun, you’re partying. Right? Things go zero to 100 real quick, and then you add these other elements where you’re in a very sort of sexual situation, and it’s like you’re talking through difficult emotions. So, yeah, we were, like, fully on board.
Amir [00:21:59]:
All the love, pheromones and hormones and stuff like that were there. So you’re fully irrational at this point?
Robbie Kramer [00:22:05]:
Yes, totally. However, I’m thinking I’m totally rational.
Amir [00:22:10]:
Totally.
Robbie Kramer [00:22:11]:
Right. I’m like, great, she’s on board. Everything’s good. There were those little instances of red flags, whatever. Right. I subjected her to this crazy party, and we left the party a lot closer than when we went to the Maldives. I’m like, if a relationship can survive that, it can survive anything. That was my conclusion. Right.
Amir [00:22:33]:
Got it. It makes a lot of sense.
Robbie Kramer [00:22:38]:
Yeah. I mean, if you can bring your girl on a boat full of 20 other models and hook up with them and have her not be jealous and have that be cool, it’s like you found, you know, you found the the unicorn. In my mind. That’s what I was thinking. But yeah. So we get back to La. And we go back to my buddy’s place, and we shower, I think, take a little nap. And around, like six or 07:00 p.m., she was like, hey, I need to run out and meet up with a friend and record some music. Or it was like no, it wasn’t that. I need to pick something up. I need to get my stuff. There was like some extra stuff that she needed to get in, like Malibu. And I was like, all right, do you need a ride? And she’s like, no, it’s cool. I’m just going to grab it.
Amir [00:23:29]:
She needs to get stuffed in Malibu.
Robbie Kramer [00:23:36]:
Right? So I’m like, all right, that’s a little sketchy. So she ubered there, right? And then we had plans. This was at like six, I think. We had plans later that night to hang out with my buddy who we were staying at. And he arranged there was like some party happening that was going to start like 11:00, right? And she was basically going to Uber there, grab the stuff. We were back, so like 10:00 rolls around. I still hadn’t heard from her. I was like, yo, what’s up? No response. Doesn’t show up that night. Doesn’t come back to where we’re staying. All next day, nothing, right? Next night, still nothing. And at this point, I’m starting to worry.
Amir [00:24:22]:
I’m like, well, you must be also super embarrassed. I mean, because your friends like, you’re staying at your friend’s place and he’s going to meet her. This is probably there’s probably a lot of hard emotions. Yeah, totally.
Robbie Kramer [00:24:32]:
Yeah. I mean, he had met her before we left, but still, it was like it was just super embarrassing. It was super weird. I was trying to play it cool and not text her or call her. But I was also concerned that something had happened. It’s so weird and out of character for someone to just houdini like this. All of her stuff’s here. What the hell is going on?
Amir [00:24:59]:
How did you see her feeling all those emotions? Talk to me about what you felt when that was happening and what are some of the things you tried to do to handle it? What was that like?
Robbie Kramer [00:25:10]:
I was really distraught. I couldn’t concentrate on anything. I was just constantly thinking about her and thinking, how should I try to communicate with her? I was very concerned about looking over invested. I was very concerned about because I had some trauma prior to that from feeling over invested in girls. And I didn’t want to seem like the psycho who was like, where are you? Right? At the same time, it was like, where the fuck are you? What the hell is this? You said you’re going to be gone for a couple of hours, and now you’re gone for two straight nights.
Amir [00:25:52]:
Literally a few hours before, you felt like you guys were in love and you’re going to be together. And now you’re in this place of like, she’s gone. And you’re trying to figure out how to deal with I’m sure you felt a sense of betrayal. And you’re probably embarrassed because your friends know this is happening, right? There’s probably some shame there, right? And then you’re also trying to figure out literally tactically, how do I interact with her? Because I don’t want to seem this way, but I suspect I was just betrayed or lied to in some way, because what’s the possible story that would explain this? Besides, I got hit by a car. Right?
Robbie Kramer [00:26:33]:
Exactly. Like, no text, no call, no communication, zero.
Amir [00:26:39]:
And you have to sit in that feeling for a long time trying not to react. Right?
Robbie Kramer [00:26:44]:
Yeah.
Amir [00:26:45]:
How did you manage that? How did you manage that need to desire to react but not doing it?
Robbie Kramer [00:26:50]:
Well, I leaned on my friends. I called my buddy, my best friend, and he had a ton of experience with these sort of things, girls betraying him. And he actually had an ex fiance with the same name, and he’s like, dude, this girl is exactly like my Carrie, and she pulled this shit on me. She is, like, such a narcissist crazy. And it was very helpful just to talk to him. We spent hours on the phone, I think, both days, you know, talking about, like, sort of personality disorders and trying to make sense of her behavior, you know, psychoanalyzing, everything. But it was just like being able to talk about it with a buddy instead of just having it fester in my mind was incredibly helpful.
Amir [00:27:42]:
Well, shout out to the interconfidence community, because that’s exactly the situation that I had last week, which prompted this whole discussion. That’s exactly what I did. I mean, those guys, especially the guys in the Brown Belt Lounge, really propped me up. There were some reactive moments. Nobody saw it but you all, so thank you.
Robbie Kramer [00:28:01]:
Yeah, man. Because you can try to talk to your normal friends about this stuff, but I feel like they’re not really going to understand unless they’ve been through these situations with somebody or they’ll say they’ll.
Amir [00:28:11]:
Frequently just demonize her. Right. And it’s actually not helpful. Be like, that crazy bitch. And she’s like, well, no, that’s not right either. Right. It’s more just like, can you just talk to me? You know what I mean?
Robbie Kramer [00:28:26]:
Yeah, I mean, there was definitely some of that going on, but also a lot of self reflection, like, what are you going to do when she gets in touch with you? How does this make you feel? And at the time, I was really struggling with keeping my own sense of dignity with women because I was kind of in a transition or a turning point where I was getting all of my personal validation through women. When I hooked up with a beautiful girl, I felt very validated. I felt very confident, and it was a very unhealthy way to get validation. Right. And I would constantly lose my self respect, lose my dignity to get sex. Right. And I didn’t realize at the time how that was stopping me from women who were who had self respect, who had a lot of dignity, who they would see that, and I was like, how are they going to see that? They don’t know. What I’m doing, but it’s like they can feel it. There’s different sort of red flags that if you have self respect and if you have dignity and if you have boundaries and that sort of thing, you can just tell when you meet someone who does and who doesn’t. But that was kind of what I was dealing with leading up to it. And then when this happened, I was like, all right. When she didn’t come back the first night, I was already like, I’m not going to see this girl ever again. And that really fucking hurt because I was in love with her.
Amir [00:30:00]:
Yeah. Were you saying you’re not going to see her ever again because your dignity, your self respect required that or because you thought she was never going to see you again? It was the first no.
Robbie Kramer [00:30:10]:
Yeah. I mean, she had to see me again. She had to get all of her stuff.
Amir [00:30:15]:
But your self respect required for that. You say you shouldn’t get to see me again after treating me like this.
Robbie Kramer [00:30:21]:
Right, exactly.
Amir [00:30:22]:
And you were at a point in your life where that was the most important thing to you.
Robbie Kramer [00:30:25]:
Yeah, I had kind of just turned I mean, this is what allowed me to turn that corner and say no to the first time, because in the past, I would just let those things go. I’d let them apologize.
Amir [00:30:36]:
You would sort of sacrifice that dignity once you made this change. How did women respond to you when they realized that you could not be manipulated with sex because your self respect is more important?
Robbie Kramer [00:30:50]:
It was a pretty profound shift. I could tell that the ones who I previously kind of felt like were out of my league treated me differently. I wasn’t chasing. I wasn’t investing over investing. It really kind of opened the door for a new level where I felt like I was worthy of both the most beautiful women and the most beauty. Not just outside, but inside too. Like a really good person who has boundaries, who has self respect, who has that integrity and dignity. And I really just didn’t get it because I had wingman. Like my buddy I mentioned, he was always kind of harping on me. He’s like, Dude, you have no self respect. You’re basically like you’re staying up all night trying to hook up with girls at parties, and the other girls see it and they just think you’re kind of a loser. Like the really high value girls see that. And I’m like, well, how do they see? They don’t know what happened. But he was right. And it took me like, maybe two, three years to kind of actually realize that. And it wasn’t so much, I think, about those specific instances. It was more I really saw that this was an opportunity where if I wanted to put myself first and maintain my self respect, there was nothing that she could possibly say that would fix what she did. It was just such a huge red flag. And then if I would allow that to stand, or even if she did own up to it, and she’s like, actually, I went and I hooked up with an ex, and I was there for two nights and having crazy sex. Even if I forgave that, that’s the most simpy shit ever. And it would just open.
Amir [00:32:40]:
So basically, it sounds like you were at a place where you were starting to recognize you’re starting to take your self worth very seriously. And you recognize that even though you’re in a really bad position with this woman and how she treated you, and there’s really no explanation, even if she was hooking up with other people, she still could have texted you and said, hey, I’m not going to be back. Right? There’s really no explanation for that behavior. It’s acceptable, but you recognize as actually an opportunity to increase your self respect and dignity because you could say, that’s fine, you’re never going to fuck me again. Right? And then you could grow inside yourself in terms of your confidence that you really are worth something.
Robbie Kramer [00:33:20]:
Yeah, that’s exactly it.
Amir [00:33:24]:
One thing that I noticed when this has happened to me, it’s happening a couple of times. Not often, but something like this happened a couple of times where I felt really like I was starting to really trust a girl and feelings for her. And then you just get a complete something like this. Although yours is way worse, right? One of the things that I found myself doing is thinking over and over again, like, what could explain this? That isn’t terrible, right? Because the terrible ones are obvious. Right? And I was just like, what explanation did you find yourself doing? That is like trying to find explanations that made sense.
Robbie Kramer [00:33:58]:
That’s what I I couldn’t stop doing that. Like, I I couldn’t do anything else, right? It was like my brain was hijacked with those thoughts, and I couldn’t even opt. Like, I couldn’t even eat. I couldn’t sleep those nights. It was like fucking torture. What do you do when there’s someone you care about has houdini and you have no explanation? You’re trying to think of all the different scenarios. They’re all terrible, right? Because it’s like, either she’s dead or she’s a horrible partner. That’s it. Those are the only two scenarios.
Amir [00:34:37]:
This is the place of things going around around your head. Yes. So now what happens? You hear from her. What happens?
Robbie Kramer [00:34:43]:
So she, like, calls me and she tells straight call.
Amir [00:34:48]:
No text, just a straight call.
Robbie Kramer [00:34:50]:
I think maybe she texted first and I didn’t respond. Yeah. So she texted first, I didn’t respond, and then she calls me. By the way, this is the exact.
Amir [00:35:00]:
Same pattern I’ve gotten. First a text as if almost nothing happened, right?
Robbie Kramer [00:35:05]:
Yeah.
Amir [00:35:05]:
And then no response. And then a phone call. Right? It was like, she’s first just like, am I going to be able to slide this shit through? So you’re just going to like that’s the text.
Robbie Kramer [00:35:14]:
Hey, babe, where are you? What are you doing? Right? It was like one of those I remember I was at a gas station, like, pumping gas, and I got that text, and I immediately called my buddy. And I’m like, dude, she just fucking texted me like nothing happened. And he’s like, yes, that’s exactly what she was going to do.
Amir [00:35:29]:
Every time. So predictable.
Robbie Kramer [00:35:32]:
So then she calls me. I don’t pick up the first one. The next one I pick up. And I’m just like, what’s going on? And she tells me like, oh, I went. And then we started recording a song. And then my agent called me, and they wanted me to stay all day and record more songs the next day. And I’m really excited because I think I’m going to get this contract.
Amir [00:35:59]:
So she’s basically going like this. Nothing is happening. Nothing is happening. Yeah.
Robbie Kramer [00:36:05]:
I’m like, oh, you don’t think it would have been normal to text me any of this or just send me a call me. Hey, not going to make it. Later. Had this amazing business opportunity come up. Like, oh, my phone died. And I’m just like, okay, the phone died.
Amir [00:36:22]:
Thing is like, oh, my god. It’s like, so you get it so often. It’s like, really? And none of your friends had phones either? And there was no power, and you didn’t have a computer, so you could log into Instagram and fucking message me there, right? Nothing. Couldn’t do it. Okay. Sorry. Makes sense. That’s totally reasonable.
Robbie Kramer [00:36:46]:
Totally reasonable. The audacity to even say any of that shit.
Amir [00:36:53]:
That’s such a like, hey, look, every guy I’ve ever been with has taken my horse shit. And as long as I had sex with them after, they sort of let it sly, you’re going to do that, right?
Robbie Kramer [00:37:04]:
Right?
Amir [00:37:05]:
Yeah. And Robbie, turns out I respect myself now. Yeah, what’d you do?
Robbie Kramer [00:37:10]:
Yeah. So I was like, well, your shits at Todd’s. Good luck at my buddy’s place.
Amir [00:37:20]:
Good for you. Good for you, bro.
Robbie Kramer [00:37:22]:
Yeah. And she was like, well, what do you mean? You’re going to be there? I’m like, no. And then I hung up and I think I hopped a flight to New York.
Amir [00:37:33]:
How did that feel? How did that feel?
Robbie Kramer [00:37:37]:
It felt really good to just now she had to sit with that. So that felt good to, like revenge. Like, now you get to, you know, deal with these shitty emotions, you know, obviously not the same, but like, I you know, I just needed to I needed to get the hell out. Luckily, you know, I had I had a spot in New York where I was splitting my time, and my buddy was there. And I was just kind of able to just unplug and go there and chill and get my mind off. But it was like the pain of any breakup, right. And that shit takes I found that breakups kind of take at least an equal amount of time where you’ve been together if you’re really in love with a girl, right?
Amir [00:38:24]:
Yeah. That’s really good. One of the things I think I think is really important here is when you’re enforcing boundaries of somebody, and that’s what this is. You’re saying, this is how I’m going to be treated, right? Or not treated. If you’re treated this way, I’m going to leave. That’s a boundary. That’s a true boundary. You do whatever you want, but I’m going to do what I want if you treat me this way. Right. So you’re enforcing a boundary of somebody. The person is having the boundary enforced. Their frame tends to be, oh, my God, this is so whatever. But what they don’t see on the other side is it also hurts you. Right. You also were in love with this person, and now you’re having to set these boundaries with this person, and you’d much rather be cuddled up on the couch with that person is how it feels to me. So I’m not only having to enforce my boundaries, I’m having to enforce the enforcement of my boundaries. Then they come back and like, hey, look, this shit goes both ways. If you think I wouldn’t rather be in bed with you and it’s not happened, you’re wrong. Right. In this case, the boundary was met. You were done.
Robbie Kramer [00:39:22]:
Yeah. And I’m guessing I mean, you’ve got a kid, so I’m guessing it’s like when you punish your kid, you probably feel really bad. Right?
Amir [00:39:30]:
I feel so guilty afterwards, too. But even though it’s the right thing to pull him away from the back of the boat, he’s going to put his foot in the propeller, I still feel guilty.
Robbie Kramer [00:39:39]:
It’s so hard to set those boundaries and actually stick to them because the drive is to just want to. And I’m kind of like a nice guy. I use the dumb air quotes there. Because what I mean is like, a recovering people pleaser. Right? I’m a recovering nice guy. So it’s like all I want is to just fix a situation, go back to peace, make up, just say, baby, everything’s going to be okay. But you just can’t do that. Right.
Amir [00:40:07]:
Well, the cost is your dignity. The cost is your dignity. And that’s a lot more valuable once you have real self respect.
Robbie Kramer [00:40:14]:
Exactly.
Amir [00:40:15]:
Yeah. So you left. You flew back to your buddies. She call you. What happened?
Robbie Kramer [00:40:19]:
Yeah, I mean, she got back to my buddy’s place, sent me a bunch of nudes.
Amir [00:40:26]:
Oh, the nudes. Oh, my God. That’s the best. That’s the best when they massively violate your boundaries. Here’s the playbook. First of all, first, let’s try to pretend nothing happened and just see if we can move forward, right? That doesn’t work. Let’s gaslight him. Right? Let’s convince him. That his accusation. That’s the problem. Not that she fucking disappeared for two days. Right. And then once she can’t gaslight him and flip the script on him, like, okay, now let’s go.
Robbie Kramer [00:40:57]:
Either way, she’s trying to apologize.
Amir [00:41:00]:
Oh, yeah. Then you probably apologize at some point, and then nudes come somewhere after that. Right.
Robbie Kramer [00:41:04]:
Nudes come after the apology doesn’t work.
Amir [00:41:07]:
Yes, totally. The playbook is so fuck. And the reason they have this playbook is because it’s worked with every other guy they’ve ever met. They’ve never met a guy with dignity.
Robbie Kramer [00:41:19]:
Right, right. It’s worked on 99. It worked on, like, if they’re hot, it’s worked on every guy. Right. And then it’s like then the guy proposes after. It’s like and then she ends up hooking up with her tennis dude.
Amir [00:41:31]:
I’ve walked out on dates with really, like, with models where they said just, like, they were just, like, really mean or attacking. I was like, oh, we’re done here. And the look on their face that any guy would just leave them standing there is blown away. It’s like, you haven’t met a guy who values himself. Right, right.
Robbie Kramer [00:41:47]:
It’s so hard to find for women also, I think it goes both ways. It’s just very hard to find people with that level of self respect in general. Right.
Amir [00:41:57]:
Well, and for guys in particular, it seems like sex shortcuts their self respect. And you have guys who, like, if I said anything disrespectful to them, they’d pull me out on the street and want a fistfight. Right. But then you offer them sex, and you can say whatever the hell you want. Right. And that, I think, is what is the core of a lot of the issues that I see with some of the guys, even guys my friends in Austin, you’ll see them doing that. You talked about staying up all night. You’ll see them sort of following the girls from place to place, hoping to hook up or whatever, five, six a. M. And then talking all week about how miserable they are and they ever want to do it again. They do it again each time, and they’re miserable when it doesn’t work. And when they do get laid, they’re elated. And you just watch this cycle, and it comes from this inability to sort of say, like, yeah, I’m tired now. I’m going to go home. And if one of these women is interested in me, I’m sure that something will happen at some point, but I’m not going to push past all of my boundaries and what’s healthy, hoping one of them will get drunk enough that we then do something. You know what I mean?
Robbie Kramer [00:43:04]:
Totally. Yeah. You’re putting this sexual experience at the very top of your hierarchy of needs. Right. Because if I get this, I’m validated. I’m worthy of these feelings that I want to believe about myself. And then maybe you’re also in this fantasy world where if you hook up with this girl, maybe you’ll be in this amazing relationship and your life will be perfect. There’s a huge sort of story to unravel there. But what you’re doing is you’re squandering everything else. You’re chasing this girl around. You’re unconsciously telling her and everybody else that’s around. That what’s healthy for me isn’t important. What’s important is me getting this outcome with this person right. Versus it’s like, no, go to bed. Focus on what you need to do to become a better guy. And if she’s generally interested, that will just make her more interested.
Amir [00:43:57]:
Yeah, well, you know, and the other thing, Robbie, I think that to add on to that is other women notice that behavior right away. Right. Talk to me about how you behave when you went bottle service or when you threw a party. Because the thing that almost every guy does and what I see is they just kind of follow the girls around. Right. They’re like, oh, the girl goes over here. Now they suddenly need to go over there too. Right. And the one they’re interested in, definitely they do that. And I now pick up on that. Thanks to your help and sort of understanding that stuff. I actually have never been that way. So that’s sort of a natural talent of mine. Very few natural talents, but I now see that and the other women see that immediately. Right. And so I’m curious, what’s your body language, what’s your positioning when you’re in these situations? And then how did other women react to that once you started shifted your vibe?
Robbie Kramer [00:44:53]:
Yeah, I think it’s very obvious to women which guys are giving off chasing energy, which guys are following girls around they’re interested in versus which guys are not doing that, which guys are entertaining themselves, enjoying the company of their friends, and they’re not putting that sexual experience with a new girl that they chased at that high level. Because there is a huge sort of mental payoff in this bankrupt idea that I can go chase this girl, game this girl, win her over, sleep with her, and then I feel like I’m the man. Right. So it’s like they’re investing in this ability or this skill set to do that. But it’s kind of the wrong thing in the first place because they don’t realize the overinvestment that’s baseline in that agenda. Right. And once I saw it, I couldn’t not see it. It was so nice.
Amir [00:45:54]:
That’s why thirsty guys, it’s like they’re covered in glow in the dark paint. Right. Everybody knows it except for them. Right. Everybody can tell except for that. It’s like one of those things you can’t pretend it’s just like it’s obvious. You could tell just their body language when they’re talking to a pretty girl. They’re all, like, leaned over everything about it, and you start seeing it and.
Robbie Kramer [00:46:16]:
You’Re like, dude, you see it a lot with the people that I think it’s the most sort of gross with is you see it with these uber rich guys who are kind of like the sugar daddies, hey, come on my yacht. Come to this expensive dinner. I’m going to tell you, right? It’s just so pathetic. And I mean, women read this before a guy even opens his mouth. Most of the time you can just watch you can just watch his body language, see what he’s doing. If you’re at a nightclub doing bottle service thing, you can just see which guys are like, actually having fun, enjoying themselves, chill. And the guys who are just like chasing women, it doesn’t take a whole lot of energy to suss that out. But yeah, once I kind of made that shift, I just started getting treated differently by both men of dignity and self respect and women. So it was a pretty radical level.
Amir [00:47:11]:
Up when you were making that shift. So you’re sitting in these places of attract, by the way. I think a lot of guys who don’t know how to meet women or don’t how to be attractive women, they think the hard part is emotionally. The hard part is meeting women. I actually think the emotionally hard part is more this stuff is like this sort of like you have to maintain your boundaries and dignity in the face of betrayal, even when it is so painful to do so. And it would be so much easier to say, yeah, climb in the bed, baby. We’re past this. Right? I think that is the biggest test.
Robbie Kramer [00:47:46]:
Yeah. This is where having abundance is so important and having options. Because if you don’t have options and that’s the hottest girl you’ve ever been with and she’s your wifey to be, you’re not going to make that call to you’re just not going to do what I did. Or you’re going to accept her apology and sacrifice your self respect. And now you’re fucked, right? Because you’re pretty much fucked there.
Amir [00:48:19]:
Well, the thing about it is this goes back to there’s a girl you’ve met. She’s a very smart girl, very kind, very curious. She actually listens to this podcast, had a deep conversation with her about monogamy. And I explained where that’s actually what I want. However, if I shut down my options, right? So to be monogamous somebody, and I’m wrong, right now I’m in this position of having to enforce my boundaries and get my needs met. And I have to do it without options. And it could take me six months to get options again. And so it’s a huge decision to shut that down because I could easily get trapped in a place where I’m being violated, my boundaries are being violated. My needs aren’t getting met because I’ve taken all her options around the table. And it’s like each time I have to enforce my boundaries, I realize that the alternative is like just being alone. Right?
Robbie Kramer [00:49:12]:
Right.
Amir [00:49:12]:
And that is so hard. And that’s why the decision. For a man to be monogamous, it’s a lot easier for a girl to stand up some leash. She might not love the guys at first, but at least she has some. She can get attention. For a man to decide to be monogamous and take other options off the table, I think the cost is a lot higher, because now every time he has to enforce his boundaries, he has to ask the question, like, what am I going to do if this doesn’t work out? It could take a long time before I feel love the reflection again, right?
Robbie Kramer [00:49:39]:
Yeah, that’s such a good point, because as a man, to be in a place of choice and to have those options, you’ve got to stand up a funnel. Right? And that is not easy. That takes a long time, a lot of energy, a lot of investment. And once you shut that funnel down, every day it’s down, it gets less and less valuable, and it’s like, eventually it basically gets to the point where that social circle or that funnel is basically no longer producing other options, and you got to start from square one. Right. And that probably only takes six months to a year for that to happen. So you make the wrong choice, it’s like you got to go and rebuild the entire thing.
Amir [00:50:23]:
You lose that time in your life plus the time it takes for you to reestablish the funnel, plus the great girls that you’ve missed out on because you made a wrong bet. So now let’s go back to the red flags along the way. So you saw these red flags along the way, but you also had these feelings right? Now, what do you wish you had done differently before you were betrayed?
Robbie Kramer [00:50:43]:
Now, in retrospect, that’s a really good question. I think taking her on that trip to the Maldives in the first place was a mistake. I think I was kind of following my previous patterns of investing too fast. Had the trip planned. I should have just gone on the trip. I knew I was coming back to La. She was living in La. There was no rush to make this work. But I had been in situations like, dating is so timing dependent. Right. It’s like the odds of her not meeting another cool dude are zero while I’m gone. Right. And it’s just a question of, is that new relationship energy going to be stronger than what we had built? So I didn’t want that to happen.
Amir [00:51:35]:
And to allow that to happen, you have to have sort of, like a really high self worth, the knowledge that, well, you can find somebody at least as good easily. Right?
Robbie Kramer [00:51:41]:
Right. Yes. That was probably playing a role in it, too. Also, I had a lot of great potential options that I set up on that trip because I curated the guest list, and there were some awesome girls that were coming, and I ended up dating one of those girls after, but that kind of slowed down. It was just kind of like a big loss across the board because I ignored the red flags. It’s a wasted time.
Amir [00:52:08]:
So you wish you hadn’t taken on this trip? Looking back each time you encountered a new red flag, what do you wish you had done after you had encountered that red flag? Do you wish you had never seen her again? Do you wish you had obviously not ignored it? What do you wish you had done differently? And I’m not talking about specifically, I mean more like each time you encounter a red flag, what would you do differently? Now, knowing being your fullness right, what sort of general actions would you take?
Robbie Kramer [00:52:34]:
Well, I mean, I felt like I took inventory, right. I was definitely aware of these things. I was discussing these things with the guys in the group and with my buddy, as mentioned, I was aware that what I was doing was pretty risky. I even mentioned to the guys in the group like, I’m going to bring this girl to the Maldives. Am I crazy? And they’re like, probably. But at the same time I get it, right. So I had a lot of help along the way, I had a lot of support. So I went into everything. I made a bunch of conscious choices, so I don’t think that would have really changed. Does that answer the question?
Amir [00:53:10]:
So my thinking based on what you’re saying is that each time you encounter red flag is just dial back the throttle just a little bit and make sure other options, I’m not saying don’t take on the trip, I’m not saying you were dumped for doing that. I’m saying even on the trip when you had the red flag with thing, it’s just don’t go more aggressively in at that point when you had a red flag. And don’t go all the way out either, necessarily, but let’s just turn the throttle back. Let’s just make sure that my other options know I exist. Maybe make sure she knows that I have other options too. Right, but let’s just turn the gas down a little bit and the gas can go back on, right? Yeah, the gas can go back on. That’s the great thing about it, right? That’s my answer there.
Robbie Kramer [00:53:49]:
Yeah. And that is the answer I would suggest. And that’s what everyone should do. I felt like due to the constraints of that trip, that wasn’t an option for me. We’re flying back together. That was the risk in the first place. Once she’s got that passport, once she’s on the plane with me, it’s like we’re spending that time together for sure. And those feelings are just going to.
Amir [00:54:11]:
Well, that goes back to this is one of the hardest, I think, going on a trip. You’re trapped, right. And if their mood shifts, for whatever reason, they’re not the person you thought they were, something happened and you’ve invested so much of yourself in this thing. That really sucks. That’s the worst, right? And so we actually had to come up in the Brown Belt lounge. One of your brown belts, I won’t say his name, was planning a trip. And there was a girl he was super into and it was a very nice trip he was doing. It was to some Caribbean destination and he was like, what do I do? How do I interact with her? And you kind of asked him a few questions and you said, substantially, and I don’t want to put words in your mouth, you’re giving her way too much power. You don’t have enough trust with this woman yet. She could go either direction and if it doesn’t go your way, you’re going to be screwed. You could tell the rest of the story from there and what you advised him.
Robbie Kramer [00:55:03]:
Yeah, no, that’s exactly right. It was an almost identical situation, except he was coming from a significantly worse inner game perspective, I think, because he’s like essentially setting up this trip with the major goal of getting with this girl. And they have a history where she’s kind of huge red flag. She’s done a lot of things to dis him in the past. And my advice was always like, just let this girl go. She’s a waste of time. And now he’s got a trip on the line and if things work out, the trip is good, and if not, it’s bad. I’m like, Dude, this is a recipe for disaster. Do everything you can to have other girls. There have other options that allow you to pivot if things aren’t going your way.
Amir [00:55:54]:
Well, I think he listened to you. I think he did invite some other girls and have a few other options, which I’m actually interested to hear the conclusion.
Robbie Kramer [00:56:02]:
He told me that the trip went amazing, so I don’t know if that means they got together or maybe someone else.
Amir [00:56:08]:
You know what’s funny about that is the psychology of having the other options means his inner game is going to be better when he’s wet round her. And she’s going to sense that. She’s going to sense that he’s coming from a place of solid confidence and not neediness and not hope. But going back, going to my story, that served this whole light of questioning, what I actually did when she finally came back around, I punched through all of her gaslighting, whatever. Eventually she sort of admits and she apologizes fully, stops fucking around, gives me the whole thing. And that’s great, right? But one, she’s revealed stuff to me about her, who she is, that she can’t I can take the apology, but she can’t take back this knowledge that she gave me about who she is and what she’s capable of. Right. And I factor and two, now everything slows down, right? And I was thinking about taking. Her on a trip to Vegas. Right. And everything slows down now. Yeah. I’m checking in with some of the other girls. Got to make sure that they still know I’m around. Right. And I think that’s really the only healthy way. And in that frame, although it still really hurts, at least you don’t betray yourself and your self confidence and your self worth by allowing somebody to violate your boundaries and not asserting them. Because I think ultimately the cost is yourself.
Robbie Kramer [00:57:20]:
Yeah, for sure. One thing that what you just said reminded me of before I met my wife. I did a lot of research on how happy couples got together. And the thing I saw over and over and over was a reporting that it was easy and it just worked from the beginning. Right. There weren’t trust issues. There weren’t boundaries being broken. It was just smooth and easy. No drama. And that’s how it remained. Right. We were both honest. We both had integrity. We talked about things that were coming up. Things escalated in a healthy way. Sometimes fast, sometimes slow. But it was just a steady, consistent, nice thing. And when I look at all of the relationships that I had that failed, it was always like there were these things that came up in the process. And I’m not saying some couples don’t work out when they get over the stuff. People can change, but it’s pretty interesting about that consistency that I saw.
Amir [00:58:29]:
Typically they’re the best version of themselves when you meet them.
Robbie Kramer [00:58:31]:
Right.
Amir [00:58:34]:
Have you ever read Gottman?
Robbie Kramer [00:58:36]:
Yeah, that’s actually what I was exactly.
Amir [00:58:38]:
What I exactly, right. Well, this guy, you guys should read him. He literally studied couples over like, 2030 years, took video recordings of them along the way and was able to relate back to ones that failed and how they were in the beginning and draw really strong conclusions about these leading indicators. One of the biggest, one indication of the relationship was going to fail was anything that resembled contempt. That was the word. Anything that resembled that. Like eye rolling, that sort of stuff. It’s like game over.
Robbie Kramer [00:59:09]:
Totally.
Amir [00:59:10]:
Dude, this is awesome. This is super helpful. I think that one of the biggest takeaways for me is that even when you’re at the level of game that Robbie is at, this stuff is still really hard. And ultimately it seems like the thing that you remember a lot more than whether you had additional sex or whatever is you remember how you felt about yourself on the way out. Right. And I think that’s the piece that actually matters more than anything here 100%.
Robbie Kramer [00:59:38]:
Your relationship with yourself operating from a place of self respect and integrity and just knowing that all of the other sort of bad feelings are going to pass. Right? Like, you’re going to get over the girl, you’re going to meet someone else. And you’re the one who gets to either look in the mirror and be like, I like the guy I see. I like how that guy behaved when he was faced with a really difficult situation. And that’s what builds confidence. That’s what ultimately positions you to find the highest quality companions.
Amir [01:00:13]:
For sure. Could not agree more and shout out to the inner confidence community, especially Ford and you guys who listen to me bitch my ass off on Monday. Love you guys. Good stuff, buddy.
Robbie Kramer [01:00:25]:
Been awesome. Thanks for pulling this stuff out of me.
Amir [01:00:27]:
Yeah, for sure, buddy. Peace.
Robbie Kramer [01:00:30]:
All right, see ya. I hope you enjoyed this week’s episode. If you’re new to the show and digging our content, please leave us a five star review on itunes, Stitcher, YouTube, wherever you listen or watch. But if you’re not really digging it, go ahead. Just don’t leave us any review at all. That’d be great. If you’re feeling a little bit stuck or you just want to optimize and step up your game, we’ve opened up a few spots in our inner confidence community. We’re accepting applications. If you want to join our select group of men and experience a radical power of accountability, cross everything off your sexual bucket list and just become a beast who gets more stuff done. To learn more and apply, go to start innerconfidence.com.
